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Alex Ward/burnout 360 Interview...


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#1 Deftech

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Posted 03 February 2006 - 04:45 AM

http://www.gameinfor....1832.49161.htm

I'd paste it here but go read it so the pictures can properly accompany the interview.

I didn't read it all because the game doesnt interest me much, but I hope theres something in there for all you fans smile.gif

I did find something that always bothered me...

QUOTE
GI: Well let’s move on to the Xbox 360 version. You guys have been known in the past to do brilliant things with the PS2 hardware and even Xbox and GameCube. It’s amazing what you can do PS2 versus Xbox in making the PS2 version look better (in my opinion). Now you’re getting to toy around with the next generation hardware. What’s it like having that extra processing power and extra boost?


I know in some aspects the Burnouts looked as good or better on psoo and were fast ports to xbox and gc, but does anyone know why? is the engine just suited for lower end machines? are the devs inept when it comes to xbox development?

I can't stand laziness. And they are one of the few that did nothing to make the xbox versions of their games stand out. No offense LowProf sad.gif I hope the game meets all of the Scene members xpectations, otherwise theres going to be some major bitching in here laugh.gif

Heres the guys reply by the way....
QUOTE

Ward: You’ll see it straight away. You literally can’t take your eyes off it. It’s by far one of the best f****** things we’ve ever done. I’m so excited about it. I met with MS this morning and they’re really excited with what we’re doing on Live. I mean, it looks amazing. It’s hi-def so you can see the world like never before. You can really see the detail and what we’ve put into it. The cars look incredible. They wreck with a fidelity and force that you’ve never seen. We have the interior of the car. Not only does it look amazing in HD – we haven’t been speaking too much on what we’ve done graphically because – so what – that’s what we expect from 360.







#2 miggidy

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Posted 03 February 2006 - 05:57 AM

Hmmmm....

I had no idea the PS2 version looked better huh.gif
Perhaps this guy's talking about the whole PS2 VS Xbox sparks thing tongue.gif

However if the PS2 version does happen to look better for what ever reason then I'm placing Criterion on the jack ass shelf right next to Hideo Kojima dry.gif

#3 Deftech

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Posted 03 February 2006 - 06:22 AM

QUOTE(miggidy @ Feb 3 2006, 12:04 AM) View Post

Hmmmm....

I had no idea the PS2 version looked better huh.gif
Perhaps this guy's talking about the whole PS2 VS Xbox sparks thing tongue.gif

However if the PS2 version does happen to look better for what ever reason then I'm placing Criterion on the jack ass shelf right next to Hideo Kojima dry.gif


I do recall some textures or something looked better in the ps2 version. which burnout I dont recall, but I saw side by sides and I even noticed it.

LMAO at the Hideo mention laugh.gif



#4 m_hael

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Posted 03 February 2006 - 10:56 AM

Burnout uses Renderware, Renderware is a middleware solution meant to provide a common interface to common effects and materials for rendering. It is and will always be written primarily for the most common (and thus money making) HW... for now this is Ps2.

Granted - they do change renderware to suit their needs, but you can only change it soo much.

#5 redwolf

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Posted 03 February 2006 - 12:48 PM

QUOTE(m_hael @ Feb 3 2006, 12:03 PM) View Post

Burnout uses Renderware, Renderware is a middleware solution meant to provide a common interface to common effects and materials for rendering. It is and will always be written primarily for the most common (and thus money making) HW... for now this is Ps2.

Granted - they do change renderware to suit their needs, but you can only change it soo much.

so upcoming Black which uses Renderware will be better for PS2? i just played the PS2 demo...looked pooo, just wish there was X360 version sad.gif

#6 m_hael

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Posted 03 February 2006 - 02:14 PM

they WROTE renderware, I would imagine that black would have specific people on it making the next gen version look better than ps2.

what I was getting at was last gen.. ps2 was king.

#7 Deftech

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Posted 03 February 2006 - 02:27 PM

I forgot it used Renderware, thanks m_hael.

I believe kage likes it biggrin.gif

/runs and hides

#8 Joergen

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Posted 03 February 2006 - 02:59 PM

Having played both PS2 and xbox versions of Burnout Revenge I still think the xbox version looks higher res but also has better effects, whilst the PS2 version is blurry and jagged. The only way the xbox version can look "worse" is if you play it in 480p so the fake blurriness is removed (thats line flicker blur and soften blur) and pixels revealed, while the PS2 still remains blurred.

GTA3 uses Renderware and it looks miles better on the xbox thanks to remodeled people, far higher textures and draw distance.

I cant see how 16MB (or even less where framebuffer at the same res takes a bigger % of ram) of texture memory can compete with 32MB what comes to texture fidelity but hey, guess 2X is nothing.

Edited by Joergen, 03 February 2006 - 03:01 PM.


#9 Deftech

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Posted 03 February 2006 - 03:02 PM

And just for the record, it wasnt a Revenge comparison I saw, it was one of the games that came before it. I dont recall how many there are now.

EDIT: It was Takedown, I found the Head 2 Head. Xbox still won for Graphics, heres what it says...

QUOTE
Graphics

If we hadn't been writing these Head-to-Heads for so long, we'd have a hard time believing that a PS2 racer could look as good as, if not better in some respects, than the Xbox version. However, this is the case with Burnout 3: Takedown. The talent at Criterion has mastered Sony's PlayStation 2 hardware, which is why Takedown is one of the most visually impressive on the console. While comparing the two builds, a handful of people mistook the PlayStation 2 version of Takedown for an Xbox game; they simply assumed its sharpness, all the reflections and specular lighting tricks, had to be coming from Xbox. They were wrong.

From what we can tell, Criterion developed an incredibly-solid 60 frames per second racer on PS2 and then translated that to Xbox as it went, taking advantage of what it could along the way.

The PlayStation 2 is not excessively jaggy when compared to Xbox. In fact, the two look very similar at first sight. The way reflections are handled varies, but there's no huge differences here as you can see.

Interestingly, though, these menus only run at 30 frames per second on the PlayStation 2 while they keep at 60 (consistent with the rest of the game) on Xbox. We're not sure why Criterion had no problem getting PS2 to run at 60 for the highly complicated races and couldn't get the garage to do the same, but maybe it has something to do with the "dirt mapping" and floor reflections. Whatever the case, it doesn't matter that much. We just thought you'd like to know.

. The two share the same assets, so it's really just a matter of how they're handled. The PlayStation 2, because it has no intense anti-aliasing like the Xbox, has some jagginess on wires and in the like, but the textures go "untouched," so to speak, and benefit from a sharpness, something that Xbox's more powerful anti-aliasing makes blurry.

Of course, Burnout 3 is a very fast racer; both anti-aliasing effects and textures are engulfed by motion blur effects most of the time.

Elsewhere, both show off to reveal some other discrepancies. The PlayStation 2 was the platform that Criterion perfected its blooming effect for specular light reflections. In Burnout 2 it was superior and it stands likewise for Takedown -- you can clearly see the orange bloom that highlights the edges of light reflections on the roads. That's not to say that the bright buildup of light reflections on Xbox's Burnout 3 roadways are "bad," but PS2's better bloom effect is impressive at times and bounces of the car in a similar way.

Finally, we noticed the particles on PlayStation 2 outshined (literally) Xbox in some respects. Again, we suspect that the engine work for particles primarily took place on the PlayStation 2. The result -- as you can see in the picture -- are more "glowy" sparks. They add a little more oomph when you're getting sandwiched between a semi-truck and a wall, for example.


On the whole, none of these minor details change the gameplay much at all. Both versions look amazing, but Xbox's higher-resolution textures combined with a more reliable framerate (although both are exceptional) make it a better choice in the graphics department. Not by much, though!



Edited by Deftech, 03 February 2006 - 03:09 PM.


#10 LowProfileWurm

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Posted 03 February 2006 - 04:12 PM

Thanks for the reading material Deftech.

I'll be the first to admit that ALL franchises reach a point of suckitude that stops warranting my money.

[See: Star Wars, Tomb Raider (at the current moment at least), Michael Jackson, and Steven King for reference points.]

Burnout is not impervious to this effect and Criterion has had ample opportunites to bring their A games. If they don't get it right, I simply won't buy it. You all know I love my Burnout games, but I'm not above letting developers know that they are making crap. I will be buying the 360 version for the HD graphics, new additions & online play (never got to play on Xbox1 Live due to banning sad.gif ), but after that... they need something fresh and non-EA butchered.

Carry on. laugh.gif

#11 KAGE360

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Posted 03 February 2006 - 04:27 PM

i cant really stand renderware, never thought it was an impressive engine and knowing that 1 out every 4 current gen game uses some part of it (i think those are accurate estimate) makes me sick. only burnout revenge impressed me visually.

however if the next gen MoH game is anything to go by then the next gen version of renderware should be mighty impressive indeed, though with many more options for devs when it comes to next gen engines (offset engine, wardevil RTE, crytec, unreal3, and Gamebryo) i dont think it will be as popular this coming generation.

#12 Deftech

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Posted 03 February 2006 - 04:54 PM

QUOTE(LowProfileWurm @ Feb 3 2006, 10:19 AM) View Post

Thanks for the reading material Deftech.

I'll be the first to admit that ALL franchises reach a point of suckitude that stops warranting my money.

[See: Star Wars, Tomb Raider (at the current moment at least), Michael Jackson, and Steven King for reference points.]

Burnout is not impervious to this effect and Criterion has had ample opportunites to bring their A games. If they don't get it right, I simply won't buy it. You all know I love my Burnout games, but I'm not above letting developers know that they are making crap. I will be buying the 360 version for the HD graphics, new additions & online play (never got to play on Xbox1 Live due to banning sad.gif ), but after that... they need something fresh and non-EA butchered.

Carry on. laugh.gif


I didnt meany offense by my posts, it looks to be good for you fans smile.gif

I liked the first one a lot, if I can find a cheap copy of Revenge at some point, I'll def pick it up.

#13 LowProfileWurm

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Posted 03 February 2006 - 05:59 PM

QUOTE(Deftech @ Feb 3 2006, 11:01 AM) View Post

I didnt meany offense by my posts, it looks to be good for you fans smile.gif

I liked the first one a lot, if I can find a cheap copy of Revenge at some point, I'll def pick it up.

No offense taken. I'm just bracing myself for the eventual decline of the franchise. Personally, I think there should be a limit on the number of sequels a game/movie can have just to prevent such suckitude from occuring, but I'm not in charge. It's not a knock on Criterion's creative team either. I simply think that an idea can only go so far before it needs to be reincarnated as something else. Itagaki has recognized this already with DOA4 and I applaud him for it. Needs to make more damn costumes, but I understand his position.

What more are Criterion going to bring to the table anyway? Better graphics? Coming in HD. Faster cars? I couldn't handle them any faster. MORE crashing? Then it's not really racing anymore. So I think Alex's original idea needs one more iteration to make it perfect in his own eyes, not EA's (analogous to Itagaki's take on DOA4) and then let the franchise retire until the Next Next-Generation. That's probably asking too much from EA though.. laugh.gif

#14 Deftech

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Posted 03 February 2006 - 06:34 PM

yeah EA being involved is never a good thing.

You see what they did to Ubi Soft? Already breaking contractual agreements grr.gif

I wish MS would buy Ubi so the threat of EA ruining them goes away!

#15 Rubix42

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Posted 03 February 2006 - 07:24 PM

EA purchased UbiSoft!!!! How did I miss this news!

No, hell no, no no no no no no O'NO! grr.gif

I have been a huge fan of Ubi for years. Their games are always on a high level, and they try new and innovative things (XIII for example-stellar game by the way) If EA starts messing up ther design and game development, it will be a HUGE loss to the community.








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