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#1 CJLee89

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Posted 06 April 2008 - 12:22 AM

What do you guys think about Scions? Reliability as a daily driver? Maintenance?

#2 StrictPuppet

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Posted 06 April 2008 - 05:37 AM

Scions are tight, and as with all Toyotas, reliable.

#3 hamwbone

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Posted 06 April 2008 - 01:09 PM

very good choice as far as reliability goes. just be aware that the tires they usually come with are uaually very low profile and have low tread life. keep that in mind when it comes to maintence costs.

#4 jesterrace777

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Posted 08 April 2008 - 06:43 AM

The Tc is one of the most fun little cars you can get (as far as a brand new vehicle goes) without breaking the bank. I test drove the '08 5 speed a couple of times and it was a blast. As mentioned above they are built by Toyota so it is hard to go wrong with them.

#5 twistedsymphony

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Posted 10 April 2008 - 07:43 PM

if they made them in RWD or AWD I would so own one... I f'ing love Toyota and the Scion line... I've been overwhelming pleased with all of their products in terms of cost, performance, reliability, and ease of maintenance.

I just don't own FWD cars... tongue.gif but if you can get over that the Scions are fantastic

#6 CJLee89

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Posted 12 April 2008 - 05:51 AM

Thanks guys! I own a '95 Civic right now, 94k miles. Yeah I know, it still has about 100k to go but honestly its going down the drain. Its been wrecked 3 times and I need new rotors, pads, bearing, CV shafts, the exhaust is being taken by rust and burns oil slightly. I would hate to see the drum brakes in the rear. Just spent a grand on tires and struts/shocks.

Anymore opinions/reviews are welcome!

Edited by CJLee89, 12 April 2008 - 05:52 AM.


#7 CJLee89

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Posted 18 May 2008 - 06:18 AM

I have been thinking a lot and graduation is coming up. My parents are thinking about getting me a car as a gift.

I have been thinking either a Scion tC or a Civic SI.

Any suggestions?

NOTE: We will never pay sticker price on a car so it needs to be able to be negotiated under 23k.

Edited by CJLee89, 18 May 2008 - 06:19 AM.


#8 o The Drizzle o

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Posted 18 May 2008 - 07:58 AM

you can get a brand new tc with some added options for well under 23k... thats without negotiations.

#9 hamwbone

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Posted 18 May 2008 - 01:04 PM

honda dealers are assholes about lowering their prices. they think they are so high and damn mighty, when i was looking for cars they basically told me everything else was junk and that they were fine with me buying another car.

#10 CJLee89

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Posted 18 May 2008 - 04:04 PM

Well here's the thing. If we don't get the price we think it should be at we straight up walk out and they pretty much tell us to sit back down to negotiate more. Car dealers are greedy and will do anything for business.

I want a 6 speed, which tC doesn't have, and the SI doesn't have much upgrades to choose from besides rims and the body kit. Does the SI only take premium fuel? I was looking at pictures online and the fuel door says premium unleaded only.

#11 twistedsymphony

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Posted 18 May 2008 - 07:31 PM

QUOTE(CJLee89 @ May 18 2008, 11:40 AM) View Post

Well here's the thing. If we don't get the price we think it should be at we straight up walk out and they pretty much tell us to sit back down to negotiate more. Car dealers are greedy and will do anything for business.

I want a 6 speed, which tC doesn't have, and the SI doesn't have much upgrades to choose from besides rims and the body kit. Does the SI only take premium fuel? I was looking at pictures online and the fuel door says premium unleaded only.


use http://www.fightingchance.com/

You fill out what you want, and they will fax out a purchase request to all the dealers in your area. the way they do it dealers will essentially outbid each other for your sale... you don't even need to set foot in a dealership until the price is already agreed on.

I've never used the service but several of my co-workers swear by it and all of them have been able to buy cars at <$500 over invoice.

if I was going to buy a new car I'd use it... but I don't like new cars laugh.gif

#12 CJLee89

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Posted 18 May 2008 - 09:18 PM

QUOTE(twistedsymphony @ May 18 2008, 03:07 PM) View Post

use http://www.fightingchance.com/

You fill out what you want, and they will fax out a purchase request to all the dealers in your area. the way they do it dealers will essentially outbid each other for your sale... you don't even need to set foot in a dealership until the price is already agreed on.

I've never used the service but several of my co-workers swear by it and all of them have been able to buy cars at <$500 over invoice.

if I was going to buy a new car I'd use it... but I don't like new cars laugh.gif

Thanks Twisted!

Any word on premium only? If this is the case the tC will obviously be my choice. I dont like spending any more money on gas than i have to because fuel companies are so freaking greedy!!!

#13 twistedsymphony

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Posted 18 May 2008 - 10:53 PM

If it says premium only then you should plan on putting in premium only

going with a lower octane causes the engine to misfire which can lead to damage... technically modern cars can get away with running whatever octane level you put in it because it can sense these misfires and adjust accordingly... however you're making the car run in a way that it was not designed to do just because you're a cheap bastard tongue.gif you'll lose power, and if the dealer is an ass they'll void your warranty for using the wrong fuel.

the only time I might consider using the wrong gas is if you don't really care about the car. I drive a 240sx it recommends premium and I always put in premium. I know quite a few people who use regular with no problems at all, however these people are also driving 15 year old cars worth ~$4K and looking for an excuse to replace the engine... so consider that.

Don't just think premium= more expensive... consider the differences in the fuel economy. Figure out how how much 100 miles in a tC will cost you vs how much 100 miles in an SI will cost you figuring in the price difference between premium and regular.

Also consider the difference in price you're paying for the car... how many miles do you plan on putting on in a year... how many years will it take to make up the difference in the price of gas?

Technically speaking, as the price of gas goes up, the difference between regular and premium becomes less significant because the difference in price typically doesn't move as a percentage. Premium usually costs 10-20 cents more per gallon whether regular is $1 or $4... that means if both cars get the same gas mileage and you drive 1000 miles a month you'll only wind up spending an extra $240 a year on premium... If the SI gets better mileage, then the tC then you might even be spending less on gas overall even though you're buying more expensive gas.

----

As for the 6 speed vs 5 speed, it really comes down to how it's geared... for instance the 5 speed WRX vs the 6 speed STi... the top gears are pretty much the same between the two cars, but the STi has some what of an extra gear shoved in between 1st and 2nd when compared to the WRX... the result is that the STi actually has a slower 0-60 times because it requires 3 shifts instead of 2 and typically worse Autocross times because you're typically shifting between 3 gears instead of 2. It does better at the drags, and other racing applications though.

Alternatively the Corvette Z06 has a 6 speed but the 6th gear is so tall that it's worthess for anything but low RPM highway cruising, this gear is essentially only in the car to help make it more fuel efficient. the 6 speed in my fiancee's Mini Cooper S is the same way.

also keep in mind that in general 6 speeds have more problems than 5 speeds, they're more complex and more moving parts = more potential for failure. Also with a 6 speed vs a 5 speed in the same "package" the 6 speed is almost always weaker because they have to take out some of the internal bracing to fit the extra components. That STi 6 speed breaks about 5 times more frequently than the regular WRX 5 speed because the case is weaker. Many people who do big power STi builds will actually "downgrade" the transmission for this reason.

Obviously you're not considering putting huge power through your drive train, and I wouldn't worry about transmission failure in a new car... but consider how a 6 speed is geared before you go on about "wanting a 6 speed"... and keep in mind that more gears does not necessarily mean it's better.

Edited by twistedsymphony, 18 May 2008 - 11:13 PM.


#14 CJLee89

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Posted 19 May 2008 - 01:32 AM

WOW thanks. I will take all this stuff into consideration.

tC: 20 City/27 Highway

SI: 21 City/29 Highway

So over all the SI has better MPG with both using the recommended fuels. I will do the math later and keep you updated. Plus I was thinking that a test drive of both cars would help with my decision.

#15 twistedsymphony

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Posted 19 May 2008 - 02:37 PM

QUOTE(CJLee89 @ May 18 2008, 09:08 PM) View Post

WOW thanks. I will take all this stuff into consideration.

tC: 20 City/27 Highway

SI: 21 City/29 Highway

So over all the SI has better MPG with both using the recommended fuels. I will do the math later and keep you updated. Plus I was thinking that a test drive of both cars would help with my decision.


yes definitly test drive both...

tC average mileage: 23.5mpg
SI average mileage: 25.0mpg

Todays average gas prices from: http://www.eia.doe.g...ini_report.html

Regular: $3.694
Premium: $3.919

assuming you drive 50/50 highway city, gas prices stay separated by the same margin and you drive 1000 miles a month.

tC price of gas in a year: 12000m/23.5mpg = 511g ... 511g * $3.694 = $1887.64
SI price of gas in a year: 12000m/25.0mpg = 480g ... 580g * $3.919 = $1881.12

$1887.64-$1881.12 = $6.50

Even with the Si using premium fuel the tC will end up costing you MORE in gas by about $6.50 over the course of a year laugh.gif

Of course with the difference in local gas prices and whether you do more city or highway driving, or more or less driving in a year will sway that number... even still IMO the price difference of premium is worthless as a determining factor. Also consider that if you force regular on the SI it might make the fuel economy worse...

...

In short... drive them both and decide what you like




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