Re: Terms Of Use And Warranty Terms, I need help finding a clause about MS crippling HDDs with bannings Options

[mogwaimon]

I was just thinking, although the hard drive is not damaged and the install function is legally in the hands of MS...what about the modification they do to the data on the hard drive?That can't be legal, I mean...corrupting personal data such as saved games? If anything that's what I'd be looking to attack in court. One can argue that hard drive installs are part of the service since it's an added feature, but saving your game?You bought the hard drive, that's clearly not part of a service.

Hope my first post isn't too stupid =P

[RitchieB]

software may prevent you from accessing the Service, playing pirated games, or using unauthorized peripheral devices.

There is no mention of preventing you from playing/saving from LEGITIMATE disks, or the corruption of user data. Not sure they could argue that.

I too buy legit games. In the last few months, I preordered ODST (with the joypad), CoD:MW2 and L4D2, as well as buying Borderlands and Fallout 3.

[No_Name]

I was just thinking, although the hard drive is not damaged and the install function is legally in the hands of MS...what about the modification they do to the data on the hard drive?That can't be legal, I mean...corrupting personal data such as saved games? If anything that's what I'd be looking to attack in court. One can argue that hard drive installs are part of the service since it's an added feature, but saving your game?You bought the hard drive, that's clearly not part of a service.

Hope my first post isn't too stupid =P

From what I can see the data is only listed as being corrupt on another system, plug your drive back in the console it was created on and the data is fine.

Because of that AND the clause listed on page 1 you are stuffed.

Suck it up and deal with it like everyone else.

[mogwaimon]

I guess you are right, No Name. I still think MS is overstepping their bounds, though. Today it is our consoles, tomorrow our personal computers.

[sonic2120]

I guess you are right, No Name. I still think MS is overstepping their bounds, though. Today it is our consoles, tomorrow our personal computers.

If that happens then so be it. We get what we deserve. Cheaters never win. I can't believe people are holding a grudge against MS when its the individuals fault. You people are pathetic.

[mogwaimon]

Hey, I haven't been banned yet as far as I know, too scared to check because of the HDD corruption issue. But you have to admit, manipulating your personal data is a bit extreme. It's like if your favorite MMO put a clause in their TOS that said if you were caught buying gold or cheating they would be allowed to not only ban you from their service, but send files to your computer that disabled any file transfer options on your OS, or encrypted your files so that they could only be used on that one computer. Yes, you were in the wrong, but the punishment was too extreme for the crime.

Companies are taking this TOS deal too far, like with those PC games that only allow you to install them three times total and you're done. Once you buy something in a retail store, it should be yours to do whatever you want with, without all this legalese which basically says you're renting instead of owning.

[xflbret]

I dunno if this is helpful, but here it is...

My console got banned a few days ago. I don't really care. I had no intention of renewing my XBL service once it expired, anyway. (I went into the reasons in another post but a bunch of idiotic welfare cheats and parental sponges jumped down my throat about it so I won't go there with it again.)

Anyway, I have continued to play my banned console, primarily GTA IV. I am able to continue my saved game, am able to resave once I make progress, and if I unlock an achievement it still pops up on the screen saying that I did so. I doubt that counts with XBL, but the number next to my head at the dashboard screen did increase.

Again, disclaimer, I am just continuing to play the banned console. I have not attempted, nor do I intend to try, moving my HDD or my gamesaves to another console.

I hope this helped somebody.

*slightly off-topic, but worth adding. Further reading is merely optional from here on out...

Though it seems to be lagging in progress when measured against that of the Xbox 1, I still have faith that the 360 will eventually be cracked to the level of the Xbox 1, meaning we can install XBMC or something similar on it, DVD2XBOX or something similar on it, and copy the games to the hard drive.

Even though I am not one of them, I can clearly see this community has a lot of very smart, resourceful, and driven people when it comes to modding the Xbox. I know it's only a matter of time.

So, my personal opinion...if I can't copy games to my HDD right now, that's OK. The day will come when I am able to again.

[wyldstallions]

Not complaining as was well aware of the risks.

However the disabling of the drive is nasty.
And the corruption of saves is really cheap and dirty.

If this was on a PC then it would be the equivalent of a nasty trojan virus and there would be big trouble. But we have to accept it as it comes with a couple of heavies in shiny terms and conditions suits.

I think it could be a case of unfair contract terms, but good luck with that.

Be a lot cheaper and easier to go buy another xbox or if you don't like it a ps3. Sony may well get their best christmas ever if 1 million xboxs go in the bin. The best we can hope for is the stratergy backfires and we get better or more secure firmware or bigger and better hacks...

[majinsoftware]

Not complaining as was well aware of the risks.

However the disabling of the drive is nasty.
And the corruption of saves is really cheap and dirty.

If this was on a PC then it would be the equivalent of a nasty trojan virus and there would be big trouble. But we have to accept it as it comes with a couple of heavies in shiny terms and conditions suits.

I have to dis-agree, If it was a PC it would be the same as letting you log in but you cant use the internet or create any new files or read any of your files. so basically you can just read things off the CDs you burnt.

[tysonstorm]

I have to dis-agree, If it was a PC it would be the same as letting you log in but you cant use the internet or create any new files or read any of your files. so basically you can just read things off the CDs you burnt.

I would say it's the equivilent of M$ cutting your internet connection, disabling your floppy disk drive and your CD/DVD drive to that it only reads and not writes.

Or perhaps the equivilent of being sacked from your job and being told your Manager is having an affair with your wife and she's taking the car, the kids and the home.

Either way, still sh*t.

[wyldstallions]

Or perhaps the equivilent of being sacked from your job and being told your Manager is having an affair with your wife and she's taking the car, the kids and the home.

Either way, still sh*t.

That would be a plus, get rid of stinking job and getting rid of that baggage of wife kids and house. Might be able to actually afford a propper xbox then....

Unfortunately shes already sleeping with the boss as I own the stinking company and can't sack myself

If I could then maybe I could take myself to tribunal and get a big payout...

[BoNg420]

Well originally the xbox 360 didn't have the ability to install to hard drive. That came with NXE which was an update from Live. If it came from Live for free then they should be able to take it away. Now this gets a bit sketchy since new xboxes come with NXE and I'm sure the ability to install to hard drive. I'm not sure how this applies to the newer consoles but if you're older console got banned and the hard drive locked to it, you really don't have a leg to stand on. Maybe users with Jasper systems that came loaded with the ability can fight but I assume the majority of banned users don't have jasper systems.

When you buy new games it installs updates, so live isnt even needed to get this ability.

[No_Name]

Not complaining as was well aware of the risks.

However the disabling of the drive is nasty.
And the corruption of saves is really cheap and dirty.

The data is untouched, but its blacklisted on other consoles.

The Drive is 100% functional and will remain so.

The amount of misinformation going round is staggering.

[wyldstallions]

Yeah no I'm aware that is the case, which makes it much more difficult to move from one console to another unbanned console.

Although what happens when moving from one banned console to another banned console ??

And what about offline non xbox live profiles?

My kids don't go online, don't think I'd let them with all the rasist biggoted trolls that sit under the bridge that is xbox live. Does that mean that they won't be able to move from xbox in the bedroom to the one downstairs which is daddys naughty box...



hmm guess I'll have to try it later....

[StrictPuppet]

Moronic comments have been removed, and fluffy has been issued a vacation.