Racism, Is Bush? are you? are we all? Options

[puckSR]

Im yanking this topic out of the kanye west post. That thing has gotten ridiculously long.

I hate people who use the word racist all the time.
I also hate stupid white people who think they can prove how they are not racist by having a friend who is of the ethnicity in question.

If you dont like black people, that does not make you a racist.
If you apply stereotypes to certain ethnic groups, you are not a racist.
If you use a racial slur, you are not a racist.

Racism is the belief that a certain ethnic group or "race" is inferior to another.
Racism is not disliking a race
Racism is not saying bad things about a race

Political Correctness has officially turned us into the dumbest society ever.
We use terminology nowadays like racist, sexist, and homophobic, while not really comprehending the real definition of the word.

Some people dont like black people
Some people dont like asian people
some people dont like gay people
some people dont like old people
some people dont like people who repeat themselves
there is absolutely nothing wrong with not liking someone. Actually i would assume your a lying pig fucker if you tell me you like everyone. You are also a giant sack of lying shit if you say you only hate people you know on a personal level. Maybe you dont like mechanics, maybe you dont like people who dont use deoderent. It doesnt matter. Shove your self-righteous cry of racism up your collective asses until something racist actually happens.

[chorizo1]

rac·ism

1. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.

2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

[puckSR]

thank you
exactly, it means you think one ethnic group is superior or inferior
it has absolutely nothing to do with how much you love or hate an ethnic group

[chorizo1]

thank you
exactly, it means you think one ethnic group is superior or inferior
it has absolutely nothing to do with how much you love or hate an ethnic group

I wasn't agreeing with you. Read what you posted and compare to both the defenitions.

If you dont like black people, ---prejudice based on race.

If you apply stereotypes to certain ethnic groups,---The belief that race accounts for differences in human character

If you use a racial slur, ---then that's plain ignorance.

also, they are called RACIAL slurs, and RACIAL stereotypes for a reason.

This post has been edited by chorizo1: Sep 9 2005, 05:19 AM

[bluedeath]

I wasn't agreeing with you. Read what you posted and compare to both the defenitions.

[puckSR]

Read again, your not getting my point

The confusion is this, often when we dislike someone, it is because we think they are less of people than ourselves. This is not the rule however.

I dont like people who play on PS2's and i think the PS2 is inferior to the Xbox. I do not think that PS2 people are inferior to me. I just dont like them.

I dont discriminate against them, in the sense that i dont try to hinder their existence as people. I do not show them less favor than anyone else.

Stereotype- making assumptions based on generalities

It is a stereotype nintendo players are young
Its not completely accurate, and im sure that you can tell me of many people who are not young and play nintendo game cube. It doesnt actually hurt anyone though.

The point im making with this whole thread is that you have to be malicious to be racist.
If i make the assumption that black people are better athletes than white people, is that hurtful?
is it wrong?
is it malicious?

I really dont know how to make my point any clearer within the confines of this html code.

You make assumptions every day, you stereotype everyday. It isnt hurtful, and it isnt wrong.

i.e.
Your at the grocery store, you see two open checkouts. One has an old lady the other has a younger man. You cannot see either of their carts.
Experience tells you that the old lady will probably be slow, and that she may have a large cart
Experience also tells you that men purchase less goods normally, and they rarely have large full carts, and all other things being equal, they probably wont take as long as the old lady.
This is stereotyping
Its not evil, its just your brain making assumptions to save time
Your dont have the cognitive capacity to deal with the world. You live through symbolic assumed realization of the world.

All that happens with all of these cries of racism is that people keep putting themselves and others into groups. Stop it. Unless its a problem, ignore the problem of one group disliking another group.

People dont like each other. Its awful, and horrible, and makes me sick. The problem is that you cannot get them to stop.


The reason im being so adament about the whole topic is that until i was about 8 i didnt realize that "race" existed. I thought of black/mexican/asian/native american as just an extension of italian/german/polish/british/irish/russian
I never thought of it as being any different, i just thought it was a casual thing
Then i learned about the whole slavery thing in school. That was great
Now i understood that there existed somewhat of a racial divide between blacks and non-blacks.
I was 12 when i learned that some people discriminated against hispanics. That was somewhat of shocker.
The point is you cant change the way people think, unless you gradually just let it happen. You cant force people to like each other. You can put them in a small room. You can have them say nice things about each other, but in the end, its up to the individual.

This goes further than race though
Im anti-abortion-->conservative
anti religion ------->liberal
pro guns----------->conservative
pro corporate regulation-->liberal
pro marijuana-------->pothead

FUCK labels
were so busy trying to label people that we are all fucking over this great country.

[bluedeath]

I really dont know how to make my point any clearer within the confines of this html code.

You could sing us a song and then upload and link to it. Or perhaps you could write us a poem. You could make a flash movie. You could hire an analyst to construct a series of charts and graphs and then screen capture them. Maybe you could just make sense.

It is a stereotype nintendo players are young

Your at the grocery store, you see two open checkouts. One has an old lady the other has a younger man. You cannot see either of their carts.
Experience tells you that the old lady will probably be slow, and that she may have a large cart
Experience also tells you that men purchase less goods normally, and they rarely have large full carts, and all other things being equal, they probably wont take as long as the old lady.
This is stereotyping
Its not evil, its just your brain making assumptions to save time
Your dont have the cognitive capacity to deal with the world. You live through symbolic assumed realization of the world.

All that happens with all of these cries of racism is that people keep putting themselves and others into groups. Stop it. Unless its a problem, ignore the problem of one group disliking another group.

That sounds oddly like Jim Breuer's Rant on Half Baked.

First of all to understand what happened to killer, you gotta understand who killer the dog was. Now killer was born to a three-legged bitch of a mother. He was always ashamed of this, man. And then right after that he's adopted by this man, Tito Liebowitz he's a small time gun runner and a rotweiler fight promoter. So he puts killer into training. They see killer's good. He is damn good. But then he had the fight of his life. They pit him against his brother nibbles. And killer said "no man that's my brother, I can't fight nibbles" but they made him fight anyway, and killer, he killed nibbles. Killer said "that's it!" he called off all his fights, and he started doing crack, and he freaked out. Then in a rage, he collapsed, and his heart no longer beat. wow.

This post has been edited by bluedeath: Sep 9 2005, 06:34 AM

[puckSR]

thats a great movie, im suprised you watched it though, since it did portray a black guy as a pothead, and thats a racial stereotype

Chappelle is the shit though

[chorizo1]

i understand somewhat your point about labeling people, but the stereotyping you listed as an example is not racial stereotyping.

If someone is old = they are slow--regular stereotype

Nintendo and ps2....wha????

Racial stereotypes are:

If someone is Latino = they swam over from mexico

If someone is black = they speak ghetto and shoot everyone

If someone is White = they're parents are related, and listen to country music

If someone is Asian = They know Kung-fu, and drive a nissan

There is a HUGE difference from what you listed as an example, to what RACIAL stereotypes really are. Also, when you use a racial slur the purpose of it IS to put another race down, therefore claiming yours as better. When you say you don't like black people, you are lumping them all together, not seeing any difference between them because ALL you see is their skin color. I don't like some black people i know, but it's not because they are black it's cause those particular people are pricks who happen to be black. In that other post you were refering to, a couple of guys typed the "N" word with such disregard or understanding that it makes their true colors shine through. I know they are gonna claim they were "quoting" someone else, but it's called common courtesy and mutual respect.

This post has been edited by chorizo1: Sep 9 2005, 07:00 AM

[puckSR]

Oh dude dont get me started on vulgarity

I really dont give a fuck what shit spews from the mouths of people


Who the fuck cares if they called someone a Nigger, a wetback, a Spider, or a duckbilled platypus. Words are words, and slang in particular is only as vulgar as the user chooses to define it. So relax.

If someone is Latino = they swam over from mexico

If someone is black = they speak ghetto and shoot everyone

If someone is White = they're parents are related, and listen to country music

If someone is Asian = They know Kung-fu, and drive a nissan

Its great that we define racial stereotypes, but my understanding is that their are millions of different ones.

But here is a big problem with even the racial stereotypes you listed
If i assume all black guys are gang bangers= i might assume they are up to no good
If i assume that an Asian guy drives nissan? What is the harm?

Seriously if your bitching about Nissans and lowriders, go find something more useful to "fix"

When you say you don't like black people, you are lumping them all together, not seeing any difference between them because ALL you see is their skin color. I don't like some black people i know, but it's not because they are black it's cause those particular people are pricks who happen to be black.

Your right, you shouldnt ever dislike or like people based on their ethnicity or anything else as trivial. The problem is that people do this, and you know what, its not evil or racist. Its not a good thing, its not right, but its not evil or malicious.

I think of it this way, you should never judge someone based on their appearance
I dislike obese ugly girls. Now im sure that they are nice, and im sure that they are sweet, and kind and great. I just dont talk to them very much. I know im a horrible horrible person. Im sure all of you see no difference between dating a morbidly obese ugly girl and cute girl, and you all never pay attention to appearance.

I dont dislike any "race", nor do i assume anything about the personality of anyone based on race. I just dont think its productive to turn race into anything.

about 3 years ago i remember that LA was bracing for the next rodney king. Someone had filmed a young man being punched in the back of the head by a police officer while he had him in handcuffs. There was a public backlash, the media was in a frenzy, it was proof of the racist police department. It was awful, it was disgraceful. The cop was going to lose his job, and the young man was going to sue the police department for racism. This was because the young man was black and the officer was white. It seemed so clear, it seemed so easy to blame race.

But suddenly everyone stopped turning it into a racial issue, they forgot about the public protest, and the cry to arms. It just disappeared.

Was it the man?
Had the "white" media suppressed the story?

No, when they finally talked to the officer, it was discovered that the young man in question had decided to fight back while under arrest. He had punched the cop in the scrotum. In a kneejerk reaction the cop struck the young man.

The point of all of this: I dont care what color you are, or where your from, or what you look like, or how much money you have
IF YOU PUNCH ME IN THE NUTS, IM GOING TO KICK YOUR FUCKING ASS

[gcskate27]

the sticks and stones argument doesnt work past grade school, else we wouldnt have harassment cases and the like...

and to say that not liking someone based on race isnt racist is just plain retarded:
lets go back to the def:

1. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.

2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

saying you dont like black people because they are black indicates that you believe thier race determines thier character(1)... if you dont like blacks because of this but you do like whites based upon the same assumption, you are defining whites as superior to blacks(1)... and obviously not liking someone based purely on skin color is prejudice(2)...

there doesnt have to be malice for someone to be a racist, im not sure where you get that from... theres plenty of racist people who get through every day without lighting a cross on someones yard...

[puckSR]

saying you dont like black people because they are black indicates that you believe thier race determines thier character(1)... if you dont like blacks because of this but you do like whites based upon the same assumption, you are defining whites as superior to blacks(1)... and obviously not liking someone based purely on skin color is prejudice(2)...

Im going to have to concede that most people who dont like a certain ethnic group as a general group are racist. I am still saying that they are not the same thing.

and obviously not liking someone based purely on skin color is prejudice

Yeah, apparently somewhere we forgot that "race" isnt about skin color. Its about ethnicity. It would be wrong to stereotype someone based purely on the color of their skin. Hmm i wonder

If your in Nebraska, and your walking around the University campus, and you see a very pretty girl, who has obviously spent a lot of time in a tanning booth. You are going to make some general assumptions.
She is probably very concerned with her appearance
She is probably in a sorority
Then you will take your stereotypes about sororities and apply them to her.
Now, your completely safe legally, until you go up to talk to her.
You ask her what sorority she is in?
Now you have openly admitted your prejudice, and if she belonged to an ethnic group, you would have just committed a horrible offense. But she is white, so all you did was figure out she was in a sorority.

the sticks and stones argument doesnt work past grade school, else we wouldnt have harassment cases and the like...

Thats a good point
If i called you a faggot, you could sue me for harassment.
If i called you a faggot 50 years ago, you could be made cause i just called you a woman
If i called you a faggot 100 years ago, and i did it in england, i would have just called you a log
If i call you a faggot in England today i will be calling you a cigarette

Your right, words have powerful meaning
What you dont realize is that the meaning of a word is very much subjective

Thats why you have lawsuits, and not a ticket.
If it was illegal to say the word NIGGER, a police officer would walk up to you and write you a ticket
It has to be a lawsuit because:
First someone has to take offense
Second they have to prove you meant to offend them
Third they have to prove that you meant to offend them in a way which was legally inappropriate

What the fuck is the "sticks and stones" argument
I, as an American, am entitled to say whatever i like, as long as:
I dont endanger someone
I dont slander someone



The problem is that people think its illegal to curse
or to offend someone
its not, its just rude

[TheLovingSoundsofStatic]

If someone is Latino = they swam over from mexico

Why would they be swimming?

[hugoboss1]

Im sorry but in my real opinion

Black people in general are the most racist people i remember in high school how most thought they were better in sports and in general and they would be the first to call you a cracker when mind you im hispanic and was called that based on my skin color which is the same steroetype whites are acussed of
which to me is the same as niger and im not racist i admire people who stick together and became friends with many backgrounds and they opened their home to me vice versa.

I will never kiss no ones ass and as for this kanye charactor i cant stand him

who does he think he is.he is no j-z,tupac,or biggie who cares what he says

he has an album out so he wants attention

im tired of people claiming racism

he doesnt win an award or get that job ....racism...get over it life is hard dont look for excuses just move on to the next..

[hugoboss1]

Why would they be swimming?

hey my parents are cuban and have been here for over 50 years.

cubans not mexicans are the ones who have to s

wim for freedom you ignorant fool

i know roll...roll..yor boat crap...it doesnt bother me because i was born here and so were my sisters and thier kids its called generations buddy and most of you came from somewhere else too..that the ignorence that screws up this country

unless you are native indian shut your mouth..or look up the true meaning of the U.S.A freedom and justice for all...

This post has been edited by hugoboss1: Sep 9 2005, 03:50 PM