Shane Kim: 'Our Competitors Don't Recognize The Importance Of Relation Options

[Xbox-Scene]

Microsoft's Kim: 'Our Competitors Don't Recognize The Importance Of Relationships' Posted by XanTium | May 22 00:38 EST | News Category: Xbox360

From gamasutra.com: [QUOTE] At the Vancouver Game Summit, Microsoft executive Shane Kim delivered the keynote - in interview form. The Microsoft Game Studios boss was quizzed by The Electric Playground co-creator Victor Lucas. On Microsoft Game Studios' role, Kim explained, "Our job, for the last four or five years, has been to become a first party that drives a successful platform. It's very expensive to develop the high-end multiplayer HD content. It's very difficult to rely on third party for these reasons - GTA is an exception. It's not a matter of quantity, but a matter of quality. We really try to do things we believe in." Kim indicated that acquiring external developers is not something "to look at lightly," but it is on the table. "That's always an option for us," he said. Victor then brought up Bungie, which undertook a high-profile move to independence after being a subsidiary of Microsoft for several years. Said Kim, "We still have a strong working relationship with Bungie - you could even say stronger than it was before. In this industry, independence is a strong motivating factor. The good news for us and for Halo fans is that we're still working with them. They love Xbox 360, they love Xbox Live, so it's really not about publishing on other platforms. There are trade-offs on the creative and development side when you go multi-platform." The exec was unwilling, however, to address when that system [Xbox Live Arcade - downloadable games] would scale up to offering larger, retail-sized games. "That's a really complicated issue," he admitted. "It's a little more complicated to download full content. We are developing resources to manage storage, bandwidth, and all that, so it is inevitable, but I'm not sure of when that will be." On dealing with third parties in general, Kim said simply, "Microsoft people are just nice people. There are some important constituencies out there. When we began, we were the new kids on the block, and we needed to work hard to earn trust. We're fortunate in that some of our competitors don't recognize the importance of relationships. Our communication becomes a huge advantage during launch and marketing with retailers." [/QUOTE] [FS] gamasutra.com

[tom_mandory]

I say, microsoft as a whole, doesnt recognise the importance of relationships with their customers

[ScottyGEE]

I say, microsoft as a whole, doesnt recognise the importance of relationships with their customers

Can you elaborate? (other than bringing up RRoD which while a prime example of them ignoring customer issue for a long while, is an obvious one)

I'm not trying to pick a fight or argue with you. I just want to see what you mean.

This post has been edited by ScottyGEE: May 22 2008, 08:50 AM

[Martinchris23]

Take their software division - every Windows customer is effectively a bug-tester for their OS. There's only one reason why you would release Beta's and Release Candidates to the public and that's to save you paying for resource on bug testing.

Then the RTM version is sold and the paying customers who are also expected to continue the bug testing until finally you get to the point (about 1-2 years down the line) where you have a stable release.

It's this reason why I never purchase the newest Windows OS until at least one service pack has been released.

Unfortunately they're carrying this on through the 360: the hardware was released far too early and everyone became testers for their product. Had it gone through the correct testing procedure, the 3LoD version would have never surfaced.

[hardcandy]

The exec was unwilling, however, to address when that system [Xbox Live Arcade - downloadable games] would scale up to offering larger, retail-sized games. "That's a really complicated issue," he admitted. "It's a little more complicated to download full content. We are developing resources to manage storage, bandwidth, and all that, so it is inevitable, but I'm not sure of when that will be."

I imagine when Xbox's have enough storage.

Take their software division - every Windows customer is effectively a bug-tester for their OS. There's only one reason why you would release Beta's and Release Candidates to the public and that's to save you paying for resource on bug testing.

And what OS does not release beta's for testing?

Next, the word "Public" signifies that the product is for sale to anyone with $29.95. Previous releases of Mac OS X have been available only to registered Apple developers.

Finally, the "Beta" means...well, what does it mean? Some people contend that "beta" means "feature-complete, but still buggy." Others consider it simply "more stable than alpha." The only real common ground these days is that "beta" means "unfinished." Whether that means merely that bugs still exist or that entire features remain unimplemented has to be determined on a case-by-case basis.

Taken all together, "Mac OS X Public Beta" (referred to as "Public Beta" or just "Beta" in this article) means that for $29.95 you get an unfinished, buggy version of Apple's next generation operating system. Charging for public beta software is increasingly common among the big software companies. I paid for my copy, and it doesn't bother me too much. If you don't want to pay for buggy software, don't buy the beta. (Save your complaining for the price tag on the final Mac OS X release ;-)

At least Microsoft does not charge to beta test.

[Tiuk]

One thing I really miss about the Xbox 1 is playing games from the hard drive, being able to switch from one game to another without changing discs. Obviously that wasn't an official feature, but it would have been nice if MS had caught on that that's what customers want. Next generation, I suppose.

[spinr34]

Take their software division - every Windows customer is effectively a bug-tester for their OS.

i'm going to be harsh here... shut your pie hole i'm sick and tired of seeing people who don't know what they're doing claim it's the fault of the OS. All of my versions of Windows that I've used, 3.1 -> XP have worked perfectly fine for me. The XP Pro install I have now was installed in 2002 and it works just as well now as it did the day I installed it. Every piece of software has bugs, it is impossible for it not to. I can't say that any version of Windows I've ever used has been far worse than another. But, of course, you are some probably 'qualified technician' and you know otherwise.

Anyways, back on track of the topic. I think Microsoft has built some great relations in the gaming industry and continues to do so. There's a lot of pressure on Microsoft to be the company that does everything. If they mess up, it seems like everyone is on their back about it.

This post has been edited by spinr34: May 22 2008, 05:21 PM

[Chancer]

i'm going to be harsh here... shut your pie hole i'm sick and tired of seeing people who don't know what they're doing claim it's the fault of the OS. All of my versions of Windows that I've used, 3.1 -> XP have worked perfectly fine for me. The XP Pro install I have now was installed in 2002 and it works just as well now as it did the day I installed it. Every piece of software has bugs, it is impossible for it not to. I can't say that any version of Windows I've ever used has been far worse than another. But, of course, you are some probably 'qualified technician' and you know otherwise.

That may be the case for you but may not apply to others.
assuming mc23 does not know what he is doing is something you shouldn't do if you don't know the problems he refers to or his experience.
The problems with windows are well documented and admitted to by MS. as in the recent SP3 farce and certain AMD processor driven machine where the install of SP3 caused continuous re-boot with even safe mode unavailable. Re-installation being the only way out. MS advised not to install via windows update but use the ISO burned to CD. It didn't affect all but did affect many. It didn't affect any of my PCs with XP on but the issue is not deniable because of that. It is also not a beta release of the SP and was nothing to do with the technical capability of the people who had issues. You shouldn't need to be a "Technician" to use a computer with windows on or have to troll through searching for work rounds for bugs. Have you also forgotten he issues caused by Vista SP1?
Now for the harsh bit from me
Don't insult people in here please. Telling someone to "shut their pie hole" even with the added smiley is likely to offend and lead to flames.

Chancer *Qualified Technician* (really)

This post has been edited by Chancer: May 22 2008, 06:06 PM

[Martinchris23]

i'm going to be harsh here... shut your pie hole i'm sick and tired of seeing people who don't know what they're doing claim it's the fault of the OS. All of my versions of Windows that I've used, 3.1 -> XP have worked perfectly fine for me. The XP Pro install I have now was installed in 2002 and it works just as well now as it did the day I installed it. Every piece of software has bugs, it is impossible for it not to. I can't say that any version of Windows I've ever used has been far worse than another. But, of course, you are some probably 'qualified technician' and you know otherwise.

Anyways, back on track of the topic. I think Microsoft has built some great relations in the gaming industry and continues to do so. There's a lot of pressure on Microsoft to be the company that does everything. If they mess up, it seems like everyone is on their back about it.

I'm going to resist the temptation of biting back!

I'm pleased for you that you've never had a problem, especially with Windows Millenium Edition which not only caused problems for home users, but for the unfortunate small business users I had practically BEG me to remove in favour of 98SE (which at the time was the most compatible and stable OS that MS had released, even after XP).

If all you use your OS for is web browsing, Word processing and the emails, you'll probably never have a problem with it. Once you push the OS to it's fullest capacity, that's when the cracks start to show. You wouldn't test drive a car at 10mph now, would you?

You can rest assured I'm qualified when it comes to hardware and software, having been servicing both for the last 15 years - let's leave it at that.

At least Microsoft does not charge to beta test.

Did the OSX Beta expire too, like the XP and Vista Betas released (rendering them useless)?

If not, then I'd say that's $30 well spent when you consider how much more stable and versatile OSX is in comparison to Windows?

[spinr34]

If all you use your OS for is web browsing, Word processing and the emails, you'll probably never have a problem with it. Once you push the OS to it's fullest capacity, that's when the cracks start to show. You wouldn't test drive a car at 10mph now, would you?

my 'car' has been test driven at max speed for 6 years now. i could go on about other things but since chancer asked so nicely, i will not. even though i have things to say about both of your posts. i'll leave it with the following. years of experience doesn't really mean anything. you can do something for 50 years and not necessarily be good at it. there might be someone that has done it for 1 and is better. sure, it's unlikely but, completely possible. to me, the quality of a 'professional' is someone who has proven theirself through the years of experience. someone who can point to everything they've worked on and show how the situation has improved and not just been maintained. anyways, i'll leave it at that, even if there are further replies, i will remain silent about it. let's get back on topic

[hardcandy]

Did the OSX Beta expire too, like the XP and Vista Betas released (rendering them useless)?

If not, then I'd say that's $30 well spent when you consider how much more stable and versatile OSX is in comparison to Windows?

For those that are still using the Mac OS X Public Beta as your primary OS or on a test machine, that version of the operating system will expire today. The May 15th expiration date was originally announced when the Public Beta was released late last summer, which essentially set today's date in stone as the deadline for delivering OS X 10.0. Apple beat that deadline by well over a month, and those that have continued to use Public Beta and not made the switch to OS X 10.0 will not be able to use the Public Beta after today.

Expired may 2001-no better than Windows

I use all three OS's at home. I actually prefer Windows Vista (with SP1) for routine stuff and gaming (just a couple of games). Never has crashed on me.
I prefer Linux for playing around and upgrading and tweaking.
And OSX for pictures and some video.

[spoone]

hey everybody,

i think that whole article is not about windows in any way...
it is "somehow" more xbox-centric. or did i miss something?

as for the headline i think mr kim is wrong.
at least sony has square enix with the final fantasy franchise and konami/kojima with metal gear.
(don't say FF is on nintendo as well because it is impossible to make a HD version of FF on the wii!)
that's just what comes to mind immediatly and these will drive sales as soon as they come up with something.
mgs4 is on its way and i believe square has something big up their sleeves pushing the ps3.

my 2 cents,
spoone