RBJtech
i'm getting a new motherboard from ebay soon, its all new and with the new gpu heatsink so i wanted to ask you if i should do the MkIII on the new board?
will it prevent the rrol from happening?
or should i just leave it as is until the day comes?
waiting for an answer 10x!

If you mean new GPU sink with the extra heatpipe - then I would not bother to do the mod. If just a normal heatsink, then as a preventitive measure, then yes I would do it.

yes its the new gpu heatsink with heatpipe..
10x for your answer

After you mount the heatsinks in the MKIII, do you not use any nuts to screw them down? From what I can read in the guide it seems as you don't have to bolt them down?

I got my 360 to work again by using the MKII but last day or 2 its had slight stalling on games on dashboard nothing major but jsut wondered if theres a way to stop it or prevent it getting any worse? maybe do try tightening the screws up?

You attach the sinks using their original threads - so there is no need for any nuts - the significant advantage over the MkI method.

danjef - I suggest you try the MkIII method - the MKII is no where near as reliable as the MKI or III.

hi all,
I tried MKIII after originally getting the 3 rlod's after performing MKIII, I again received the 3 lights. After tightening some screws I now get 4 red lights. after some time I figured what the heck, I plugged into the AV cable and .. no red lights, but theres also no output on the screen and the center green light just keeps blinking.. uh oh spaghetti oh's ... any suggestions? i guess i'll try mkI

thanks

it says at the end the heatsinks should get hot within a minute or so. Do we turn it off right when they get hot? or wait a bit?

does this fix work for 0020 as well? because i tried it , and i still get 0020

Hi, there! I've got an XBox giving ROD error 0020. I've tried MKI on that with different amounts of washers, but only could bring it back to live by heating it, (by turning the fans off), but as soon as the box gets cold again (after waiting 30min or so) it would boot into 0020 again. I found, that leaving the washers under the mobo away (so there are only the nuts) gave me better results, but it didn't last either. From time to time I also could fix the ROD by simply adjusting the screws of the gpu h/s but this would allow me to boot only one or two times and would freeze before or in dashboard. After that again ROD. So I think, to fix this box I probably need a shim. Now my question is: Has anyone around an idea where you could find a shim at a private house? Or where you can buy it? I've looked at the fins of my gpu h/s, but they seem too small for the main die of the gpu and also, they are not flat, as I bent them out with a gripper, and I don't have any tools, to clear their surface or st. I've been running through my place the whole day, but I can't find anything suitable doing that job. Any Ideas on this?

Thx in advance
lag

@securitae: The test with waiting a minute for the h/s to get hot is only for seeing, whether the h/s has good contact. If it gets hot, you can turn your box off and know, that there is good contact, so no need to change.

As you can see in my last post, I also have error 0020 and have tried a lot of things with no success by now. I think my box needs a shim to be fixed, this is also the conclusion in rbj techs MKI tut if anything else fails. Maybe you should give it a try, too, if you find st. usable as a shim.

I am kinda getting worried about the MK I procedure, from all the stuff I have read... it seems as though the 3 ROL problem comes back after a few months or so. So it seems like it really isn't permanent. Any rebuttals?

TTT

RBJtech, on your mkiii tutorial, you suggest using a single washer on the CPU. Why is that?
From what I notice, the heights of both chips, CPU and GPU are the same.

By the way, I've made the mkiii fix and work good for me for two weeks, until yesterday, 3 red lights again 0102, as usual on my xbox.
I opened the console, made the fix again, now with 4 washers below the board. Heated things up, a little bit, and it did come back from the dead again!

hi guys,thanks to rbjtech for the exccelent tutorial,fixed my buddies 3rrod with an error 0102,using the mk1 tut using 2 washers between m/b and heatsink,only tested that 1 for 2 days but no probs,then when i booted mine up after fixing his mine 3rrod but with a diff error code 0201,mine threw up about 4 different error codes but the main 1 0201,did the mk1 with 2 washers and all works perfect,had mine on test for 6 or 7 hours staight and seems ok no freezez.thanks again guys keep up the good work

I have read all through this topic and others, and I just want to know if it is safe to use metal washers against the motherboard?

I have scoured my city and there are absolutely NO nylon washers. I have metal ones, and they do not go outside of the copper that is on the motherboard around the holes where the x-clamps were attached.

I am just worried that using metal washers can mess something up. Anyone able to help?

The metal washes only barely touch some traces on the motherboard, which I don't think should affect anything, because traces are partially buried. I was worried too...because on one washer...I think to traces may be covered...but oh so slightly. I didn't blow up on testing though....so.




Anyway. I enacted the MKIII on my console for preventative reasons, but also to try clear up some artifacts on my console.

The mod went well. I used M5 machine screws with larger heads on them (cheese heads?). They were a little big and I didn't do any counter sinking. The screw heads made contact with the plastic case....and made the metal case wobble slightly in the larger plastic case. Upon putting it all together however, the case came together just fine.

I used only metal washers that were in the box labeled 5mm metric flat metal washers. I suppose these were the right ones. I don't know if the height was correct, assuming all 5mm metric flat washers are the same height.

Anyways. I used AS5 applied very thin with a business card on the CPU and 2 GPU dies. The tightness on the screws I tried to get as uniform as possible. Its very tricky, so I just used my own judgment and feel on trying to get them as all as uniform as possible. I still don't know if its right, but its working. I also didn't use a shim.

Anyway. I was first VERY glad I didn't CREATE any overheating or 3RLOD with the proactive mod which I thought I might just do if I didn't do it right. I worried when I got a black screen after first powering up, but that had to do with the switch on the av cord being set to TV instead of HDTV.

I've done about 3 2 hour gaming sessions. The heat coming out the back of the 360 is very hot, suggesting the heat sinks are performing well.

The screws won't come loose in time will they? Back out? I'm playing vertically.

So far...my color/artifact problem has not occured yet. I'm going to keep testing it out. Right now, I think I may have pro actively cured my console from the artifacts which lead to black screen. I don't know. Thats my story. Hope it helps. No 3RLOD/Overheating/Artifacts......Crosses fingers, knocks on wood. I'll keep testing and report in.

I thought this this tweak to the tutorial could be added in, as I think it could help in trouble shooting the tightness of the bolts. My father came up with this idea while he was helping me perform this fix.

I simply drilled pilot holes through the metal case, and out the plastic, then removed the metal case and bored out the holes to be slightly larger than the heads of the screws. At first I was getting the 3ROLD, but after tweaking one bolt tighter, it worked perfect and has not froze after 8+ hours of play now, with it being left on for multiple hours running Gears of War.

Anyway, here is a pic of the mod:

http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m236/Wi...ks/DSC01671.jpg

Please feel free to add it to the tutorial, and if this was already suggested by someone, then nevermind. I just thought it would save people the trouble of opening the case every time they need to tweak the bolts a little.

It also allows you to avoid counter-sinking the screws into the case. All in all, I think this is the perfect finish to a great mod/fix.

If you have any questions, please feel free to ask and I will do my best to help out.

Can we use the "X-Clamp(MKIII)" and "3 Penny Fix" methods together without any conflict?

just tried MKI, bought some M5 bolts off of ebay because these things are surprisingly hard to find in Canada. just a suggestion to anyone trying MKI.... the GPU bolts, 15mm was too long for me. I tightened them up, went to try it. the cpu got hot right away (20mm worked fine) but the gpu didn't. i looked through the rear vent holes and the heatsink wasn't even touching the gpu die i had to take my screws out and file about 1.5mm off each one. then it made contact.

also, I had to tighten these bolts up like MAD... much much tighter than I was comfortable with. i was waiting to hear a die crack any second.

the kicker is that i was getting 3RROD since april, my first test of MKI started giving me 2RROD. test two gave 2RROD. i went and got pliers and tightened the bolts up like crazy, gpu got hot on test three and no more 2RROD or 3RROD!! put everything back together, worked okay in the dashboard. went out and bought forza 2, came home to play it and we're back to 3RROD...

im tired of messing with it. im gonna put some .30-06 holes in it on sunday and go out and pick up an elite on monday. im tired of it.

hi, if anyone has given up on this and has a spare non-cut up GPU heatsink that they would be able to sell me in the UK i would be very grateful or if anyone knows where i can buy another, thanks anyway
Chappers4321

hi again my xbox has now 3rrod again it only lasted 2 days,oh well,not sure im gettin another 1 tho as this was my 5th 1 others replaced on warranty but i thought i was safe after a year or so and opened it

im rethinking buying another one, as well. screw it, M$ doesn't deserve any more of my money. im gonna make a video of me putting holes in the 360 from 100yards, put it in a box and mail it to Ballmer's office with a link to my video on youtube.

this is BS. they know damn well 3RROD had nothing to do with my 360 being opened, but they won't take it back. yet Ballmer keeps saying they are "taking care of their customers". pffff. i guess my PC will be doing all my gaming. like i'm any less of a "customer" because i sliced a shiny sticker. (actually I got it off without damage, but lost the thing. HAHAHA)

Yes I was wondering the same
MKI has 3 washers to reach 2.13mm, MKIII should be the same, the height shouldnt change from both methods
or there is something else I dont get?
5mm washers are usually .8 or 1.2mm thick

the ones i got were .99mm - 1.0mm exactly. i used 2 - the board can move .13mm (.005"), i don't think it is really going to matter. plus i don't have access to anything .005" thick, even the thinnest shims are 2x that that i could find. this setup gives me a very good AS5 contact patch.

After the MKIII and reapplied AS5 it now gets very hot out of the back of the 360, was this the intended idea or is it abnormal to be quite hot?

To add to the thread too, I had to use 4 washers underneath the motherboard on the bolts as it would always 3ROD on 3 bolts and prior to mod I only had crashing no 3ROD.

Well, I think that if you're getting hot exhaust air out the console that's a good thing, I mean, more hot air outside is better than more hot air inside.

I some what fixed my box with MKIII after several minutes of tweaking the screws I got it working and played all pro football for a 30 mins. minutes after that i started getting artifacts will play NCAA 08. I getting some new fans and Im going to do the shroud mod. Do you think I should tighten the screws a little more on the gpu?

How can I be sure the height of my washers was correct. When I put the three beneath the mobo in the MKIII method, I don't know if the board was 100% completely flat. The board showed a fraction of movement when I would press on it in the regions around the holes. I used 3, 5mm metric washers from the local hardware store.


Are 5mm washers all the same height? What is height of each washer SUPPOSED to be (.71mm)? How can I measure this? (The calipers I found at a local hardware store might measure three washers stacked together, but not one at a time (accurately) I don't think. Are the digital calipers any good? Do they last?


How detrimental would it be if the 3 washers combined height was a little off?

I also don't know if 5mm washers completely stay within the brass rings of the holes. Seemed like mine poked out a fraction of a mm and touched a 2 traces in one spot.

I did the mkIII mod on my box, it made it better but i still had a lot of overheating,.. so I tried the separator in the plastic air flow chamber,.. actually made the CPU heat sink get hotter than it was before. But the GPU did stay a little cooler, So I took that out and then did the 12V mod to the stock fans,.. works like a charm,.. been playing for hrs on end just to make sure everything would hold out,.. and so far, its good. I hope it lasts.

As an added note, when i did the mkIII mod I let the system get hot then i tightened the screws again while it was hot, that also seemed to help with video freezes.

I think what was happening before i tightened the screws on the hot system, when it did get hot it would slightly separate from the die, so now it has a firm grip when hot or cold.

As another added note, I knew from the beginning that that x-clamp BS was the worst heat sink design i have ever seen.

I haven't actually received the 3RLOD yet, but my 360 has started to freeze regularly after about an hours play (every time I switch it on in fact). Should I replace the x-clamp now or wait until I get the RLOD proper?
I was thinking preventative steps might be be best, but how am I supposed to tell if the mod has worked without the RLOD for guidance?

Also, I was thinking about adding a talismoon whisper fan while my console is open. Is it worth doing or will I not need it once the x-clamp is replaced?

thanks in advance

Absolutely get the talismoon, it's quieter and moves more air, plus it looks cool.

Since you've got your console already open, might I suggest you also try the shroud divider mod. You'll notice a difference.

And again, since the console is still open, you could get a couple of ram heatsinks and attach them to the memory on the console, you can get some thermaltake ram sinks for like 3 pounds, for a pack of 8.

Not really on topic but thought I'd just say that the web counter on my website (www.rbjtech.net) has now reached over 100,000 hits - yep over one hundred thousand hits ...

I bet my ISP arn't happy with me lol ...

and I bet the vast majority of that is this X-Clamp replacement tutorial ...

So thanks to all those that have visited my pages and of course X-box scene for the primary links ...

RBJtech,

I just want to ask you something. I did try your method (MKIII). However, if you press the power button it wont boot, just green light then it will turn off again. But if you keep on pressing the eject button, you will see the 4 green lights but, there's no video or sound and the power supply is blinking orange and green. Is this a power shortage? If I loosen the screw it will automatically go to 3rl error 0102. What do I need to adjust?

Hey all and thanks to RBJtech for all the hard work.

I am going to attempt the MKIII method tonight and have a few questions.

1) I have been scrubbing at the thermal grease on the CPU and GPU with Q-tips and isopropyl alcohol for a couple hours now. I can see the mirror finish that I need, but there are a couple of real problem spots. Is there anything better that I can use to clean it off other than commercial thermal grease remover?

2) Is it necessary to completely remove the thermal grease from the components close to the chips? Should I just scrape off as much as I can or completely clean it the same as the CPU/GPU?

3) How much AS5 should I apply? I am pretty comfortable with this whole process, but I have never worked with thermal grease before.

Thanks,

wilby tilwy

Hi

Let me start by just asking... how do u guys think of things like this, its amazing. Neways my friends xbox crashed and got the 3RLOD we tryed calling MS but because he bought it from another country they said he must send it back there. So we decided to fix it ourselves. We did some resarch and decided to go for the Erazor method but that didnt work. i just want to know why that didnt work and also will this method work even after doing the erazor method?

Thanks for the help

dude if you 360 is not modded and you didnt open it, better send it back to m$ !!! trust me maan all the methods that fixes the 3red lights is for temprory fix..unless if you reflow your chip (gpu) thats another story!! but its hard to find a person that will reflow your chip locally!!

Hello RBJTech and all,

My 360 is working great and has never had the 3 red lights as of yet. But recently my cousin's 360 got the red lights. He sent his back to M$ to be replaced but that is not an option for me because mine was opened. Now I want to perform the MKIII for it looks like the most promising and easiest but I do not want to end up breaking an already working system. What would you recommend I do RBJTech? I know the 360 can break any day but yet I don't know if I could break it faster doing the mod. I only see people with problems doing this mod. Has anyone with a working system tried this yet?

Any feedback would be helpful. BTW I've done the fan shroud mod as can be seen in this video...

http://youtube.com/watch?v=aZ9SjRQGE0c

The top fan mod was postponed because my HDD and DVD drive made it a tight fit for the fan.

JAmerican

Anyone willing to give me suggestions or help me out?

JA

Provided it's a success, the mod won't break your system. All you're doing is changing the way the heatsinks are attached to the motherboard - the X-Clamps are just clips, whereas bolting it on makes it more secure and gives you more control over how tight you fasten it you that you can fine tune it until you achieve optimum performance.

However the old mantra 'if it aint broke, don't fix it' is true. What's the point of doing a mod to solve a problem you don't have? The X-Clamp replacement is designed to solve overheating problems, so if you think your 360 has heat issues, even if it doesn't have the 3RLOD, then maybe the mod would be worth doing anyway. You could always just take it apart, replace the thermal paste, and put it back together using the X-Clamps to see if that improves it before doing the whole mod.

My system has frozen randomly. Like it froze once yesterday. I may do this mod. If I do, I will post the specifications for the Lowes screws. I called both Lowes and Home Depot (since their websites have no screw info), and the Lowes associate was well mannered to that of the Home Depot. The Home Depot one hung up before I was done asking questions.

Anyway, I'll let you know.

JA

(delete post)

Hey all,

I went to Lowes and picked up (50) 5mm washers, (4) M5x .8 x 16 screws, (4) M5 x.8 x 20 screws and found a 5mm nut on the floor so picked it up .

Now the screw I found is 1mm larger than the guide. can I add one more washer to the GPU's screws so that the screw is not too large? Thanks guys for your help.

LOWES - USA - MKIII Parts [Here you go RBJTech for your guide ]

Oval Head Phillips - M5-.8x20mm (Qty:2) Part # 792611
Oval Head Phillips - M5-.8x16mm (Qty:2) Part # 138566
5mm Flat Washers (Qty:10) Part # 138319

LOWES stores these screws in drawers. Look for a pinkish purple band on the drawer. In White Text, it should say Metric M5-.8 and other info.

Hope that helps. I'll be cleaning the gook thermal paste that M$ supplied my system and placing Artic Silver to see if there is better performance. On Friday, I'll be doing the mod.

JAmerican

Update: I said that I probably not would not post unless it died, well it did. I did however play the crap out of it for a month and a half.

It froze while I was downloading the Bio Shock demo. I reset it and it froze on start up. I let it sit until the morning when it loaded perfectly. Next I tried to download it again but instead told it to find mine because apparenly it finished. The screen then went black and I heard an audible crackling noise for two or three seconds and then it froze. So I reset it and went into my demos and deleted it. Strangle hold was downloading when I checked my active downloads and froze at about 35%. When I reset is when the three red lights came back.

I opened it up and everything still looked good so I went ahead and cleaned the heat sinks and applied new thermal paste. It did not work when I fired it up like when I fixed it the first time (the overheat was not necessary). After overheating it and letting it sit with a fan cooling it down it still did not work. Loosening the bolts got the green lights to circle but no picture. Reset and three red lights.

Finally, I loosened all the screws and tightened them so that they were just starting to get tight and bingo I had picture and everything! biggrin.gif When I put the case on and the lights were back. grr.gif

I have been messing with the screws a lot and cant get it to work. Now the tailsmmon fans only light for less than a second and for the first time I have error code 0002- Network Interface Problem. Any ideas?

Here are some pictures...

Before:


After:


Played my 360 with no freezes. Now my 360 does not freeze every time. It does it once in a blue moon. So I will be using it tomorrow as well then will apply the mod on Friday. It did lag a little but I think its just Gears loading.

JAmerican

LOWES - USA - MKIII Parts [Here you go RBJTech for your guide ] (UPDATED - Aug-16-2007)

2 packs - Oval Head Phillips - M5-.8x20mm (Qty:2) Sales # 138573 - $.92 each pack
2 packs - Oval Head Phillips - M5-.8x16mm (Qty:2) Sales # 138566 - $.68 each pack
5 packs - 5mm Flat Washers (Qty:10) Part # 138319 - $.56 each pack

LOWES stores these screws in drawers. Look for a pinkish purple band on the drawer. In White Text, it should say Metric M5-.8 and other info.

Also, I picked up a Kobalt Torx 8-in-1 Driver. T4 to T15. Sales # 239384 - $5.98

JAmerican

Well since I was out of options I went ahead and redid the heatsink paste again. The fans are working again but I can't seem to shake error code 0020. I have done everything just like I did to get it to work for the month and a half.

Any ideas?

Do you have heatsinks on your memory and southbride? Do you have thermal pads on your memory under the board?

JAmerican

hey guys,

here's my latest mod. just a tweak to the existing x clamp replacement tut's .

uses all stock hardware , no shims required.

I've just recently implemented this , so we'll see how well it goes. I'm pretty confident its just as good.

I don't have any pics of the heatsink with the legs in place , but when I open another box I'll take some pics.before and after

H/sink legs

mobo with legs to show clearance

any comments are welcome.

Here's a recap of my attempt at the MKIII mod. It was a success. My system was working and still works so that's a good thing. Here's a full overview with parts for the United States and pictures . Hope its helpful.

http://www.jamerican.net/?p=48

Thanks RBJTech for the MKIII mod. Really worth it.

JAmerican

How did you thread that stock piece?

I also highly recommend anyone who has a working 360 to switch to the MKIII mod because it makes you so much less worried about the clamp slipping off or your board warping. While I do not know if the mod will keep my system freeze free, I do know that its a traditional way of cooling any computing system. So I know I can sleep better at night knowing that my 360 has proper cooling.

JAmerican